Did any band go onto success without any original members left?

[Digital_Man]

Be Bop Deluxe came close when Bill Nelson sacked the whole band after their first album. But of course, it's not BBD without Bill Nelson.

That's kind of like what John Mclaughlin did with the Mahavishnu Orchestra. In 1973 after BOF he got tired of the lack of band chemistry and decided to assemble a new band. Come to think of it, Robert Fripp did pretty much the same thing with KC around the same time.

[JohnTG8]

Guess it depends on what you mean by success. To me none of the bands mentioned in this thread went on to huge success. At least not that I recall here in the States.

[MYSTERIOUS TRAVELLER]

Guess it depends on what you mean by success. To me none of the bands mentioned in this thread went on to huge success. At least not that I recall here in the States.

yep... success doesnt happen in Prog unless a band goes Pop or we get in a time machine back to 1975

Soft Machine were popular... among the tiny number known as worldwide Prog fans

[Digital_Man]

yep... success doesnt happen in Prog unless a band goes Pop or we get in a time machine back to 1975

Soft Machine were popular... among the tiny number known as worldwide Prog fans

Even from 71-75 a band typically needed a hit single to get noticed or at least massive radio airplay. Think ELP-lucky man; YES-roundabout; Genesis-I know what I like; JT-aqualung etc.

[SteveSly]

What about The Moody Blues? Not sure if I am remembering my history correctly, but were there any later members in the Denny Laine version of the band?

[dpt3]

What about The Moody Blues? Not sure if I am remembering my history correctly, but were there any later members in the Denny Laine version of the band?

Graeme Edge, Mike Pindar, and Ray Thomas were all original members.

[klothos]

The original Judas Priest, formed in 1969, featured singer Al Atkins. When that band split up, Atkins formed a new Judas Priest, but was himself eventually replaced by Rob Halford. So by the time of their first album, Priest featured no members of the original 1969 lineup.

Im with you: that one counts....there are others that will argue it. I agree with it for the sole fact there were recordings made with the original line-up so if any complete anthology was ever to be created, those early recordings would have to be included as the lineage can be directly traced to them

[klothos]

What about The Moody Blues? Not sure if I am remembering my history correctly, but were there any later members in the Denny Laine version of the band?

only one til now: Graeme Edge

Mike Pinder was an original member also

[klothos]

Not a band, but the 1969 New York Mets were the first team to have no founding members on the field - and the first to win the World Series.

How come they retired Tom Seaver's number and not Jerry Koosman's?,....that doesnt seem right! :/


<----Mets FAN, btw :P

[bob_32_116]

Sugababes: top 10 UK single and top 30 UK album with initial line-up of Siobhán Donaghy, Mutya Buena and Keisha Buchanan.

Donaghy is replaced by Range. Then Buena is replaced by Berrabah. Then Buchanan is replaced by Ewen. Their most recent album, then, is with a line-up with no originals, and they had a top 20 UK album and three top 10 UK singles.

The original line-up reunite and unsuccessfully sue for the name. They perform instead as Mutya Keisha Siobhan and have a top 50 UK single.

The line-up with the Sugababes name then split and the latest news is that MKS have managed now to reclaim the name.

This may not be relevant to prog rock, however.

Henry

It's about time the original members of the Little River Band had a go at this - reclaiming the name.

[Trane]

Gong had no original members in 1975 after Allen left. The band toured to reasonable critical success and, after further line-up changes, released Gazeuse! and Expresso II, before morphing into "Pierre Moerlen's Gong". As PMG, they released several more albums. I think that fits the criterion too.

Henry

Outside renaissance and Soft machine, I wouldn't have thought of any other example... But Malherbe??

However, Shamal and Gazeuse did sell a fair amount (not sur Expresso did, though), but more than the RGI trilogy albums?

It can be argued, however, that Didier Malherbe was an original member too, although he wasn't part of the original, but almost unknown (and certainly with no releases to its credit), incarnation of 1967-68. So in a sense there *was* an original member until after "Gazeuse !" (known as "Expresso" in the US). By the time "Expresso II" was released (and even the line-up which recorded it briefly had Malherbe in it for a few gigs), they were usually advertised as "Gong-Expresso" rather than just "Gong", and soon after that they became Pierre Moerlen's Gong.

Thx Aymeric

The question was just: "Did any band go onto success without any original members left?"
I would say SM did.

Art Zoyd changed style as well.

again a question in terms of commercial success, I'm not sure they were more successful... Certainly didn't last long after Ratledge left, though. You'd have imagine that if success had increased, they'd have stayed together longer than what they did

Not sure I'd agree. The post-Ratledge era was really the tail end of 1970s Soft Machine. They really only lasted 1 1/2 years as an active gigging band after Ratledge had left, released one album "Softs" which was begun with Ratledge still kind of on-board. And they released just one more, "Alive & Well", before packing it in. (The later "Land of Cockayne" was just a studio project.)

So to say "they went on to success after the last remaining original member had left" is kind of a stretch, I think.

Thx again Aymeric

Guess it depends on what you mean by success. To me none of the bands mentioned in this thread went on to huge success. At least not that I recall here in the States.

Well Renaissance seemingly did

The original Judas Priest, formed in 1969, featured singer Al Atkins. When that band split up, Atkins formed a new Judas Priest, but was himself eventually replaced by Rob Halford. So by the time of their first album, Priest featured no members of the original 1969 lineup.

Just like for AZ, I'd tend to disqualify this (don't mean to nitpick, though ), since the original line-up did not record anything, so in terms of success...

[calyx]

Just like for AZ, I'd tend to disqualify this (don't mean to nitpick, though ), since the original line-up did not record anything, so in terms of success...

They recorded a single... And did get some press. They were a minor part of the first wave of French underground bands in the late 60s/early 70s.

Art Zoyd only really got "big" to some extent in the 1980s when they began doing ballets and cinema-concert 'events', i.e. at the tail end of what many consider the 'classic era'.

[Big Ears]

Correct, Silmarillion where founded Dec. 78 when Mike Pointer and Doug Irvine (Bass,Vocals) left Electric Gypsy.
The guitarist of Electric Gypsy Andy Glass then formed Solstice.

Interesting. Sometime prior to 1981, I attended a gig at the Civic in Aylesbury, which consisted of Electric Gypsy (with Pointer) and what I thought were Solstice and Marillion. Now you've got me wondering who those two other bands were, besides EG.

[Lopez]

Going on to success is the term that stymies me with these bands, although they continue/ed with no original members:

The Flying Burrito Brothers (John Beland owns the name and he wasn't a member until about 30 years after the band formed)
The Strawbs (two or three shows without Dave Cousins, having quit, in the late 70s)
Spirit (the Stahealy brothers soldiered on for a while with no original members)
Canned Heat (several years without Larry Taylor, the only original still in the band on and off; Fito de la Parra joined after the first album was recorded)
The fake Fleetwood Mac (the manager contended he owned the name and sent out a replacement band)
The fake Moby Grape (the manager contended he owned the name and sent out a replacement band)
The Electric Prunes (recorded one album in the early 70s with no original members)

[bondegezou]

Thanks, Lopez, for all the additional examples.

Working in health research, I know that birth is messy and death is messy. Several examples here relate to the fluidity of early line-ups before they had any impact (Judas Priest, Renaissance, Gong, (Sil)Marillion). Several examples here relate to the end of a band's existence where some line-up without any original members strings things along for a few more years but soon fades away, or is gazumped by returning members. What is less common are these extended afterlives for some bands, where a non-original unit keeps touring behind the name (Grass Roots).

However, having a period of clear success with an earlier line-up and then a period of clear success with a later non-overlapping line-up, that's really what we're looking for here, I suggest, and that is very unusual. I think my Sugababes example comes closest, although the later line-up, despite three hit singles (in the UK), soon collapsed.

Henry

[Facelift]

Going on to success is the term that stymies me with these bands, although they continue/ed with no original members:

The Flying Burrito Brothers (John Beland owns the name and he wasn't a member until about 30 years after the band formed)
The Strawbs (two or three shows without Dave Cousins, having quit, in the late 70s)
Spirit (the Stahealy brothers soldiered on for a while with no original members)
Canned Heat (several years without Larry Taylor, the only original still in the band on and off; Fito de la Parra joined after the first album was recorded)
The fake Fleetwood Mac (the manager contended he owned the name and sent out a replacement band)
The fake Moby Grape (the manager contended he owned the name and sent out a replacement band)
The Electric Prunes (recorded one album in the early 70s with no original members)

I would say that none of these actually had much success during their tenure without original members.

[LeFrog]

The Velvet Underground released their final album Squeeze with no original members left. Of course it wasn't successful at all so probably off topic....

[bob_32_116]

There was a Puerto Rican boy band called Menudo. Not only did it have success with several non-overlapping line-ups, but this in fact was the original intention of the creator:

Menudo was founded by Puerto Rican producer Edgardo Díaz on November 25, 1977. After successfully managing the Spanish teen-group La Pandilla (1973–1976), Díaz returned to Puerto Rico to form a new group: an all-male group where the members would rotate as they grew older, with the intention to keep the group young. A member would be replaced when he grew too tall or facial hair, his voice changed, or he reached his 16th birthday

Ricky Martin got his showbusiness start as a member of Menudo.

[Sturgeon's Lawyer]

Sorry, I meant "the first Mets team."

[gojikranz]

does asia featuring john payne count. success might be streching it but hey that album is still coming soon!

[bRETT]

Going on to success is the term that stymies me with these bands, although they continue/ed with no original members:

Also Steeleye Span-- Played a few shows with a new frontwoman (Tamsyn Alexander) between Gay Woods leaving and Maddy Prior returning.

[bondegezou]

There was a Puerto Rican boy band called Menudo. Not only did it have success with several non-overlapping line-ups, but this in fact was the original intention of the creator

Yes, those sorts of things do seem to be a different case. Arguably, Menudo wasn't the singers, it was the creator, Edgardo Díaz. My question would be whether Díaz is still in charge. If he's gone, then the creative team has been completely renewed.

Henry

[Lo-Fi Resistance]

Split Enz?

[bondegezou]

does asia featuring john payne count. success might be streching it but hey that album is still coming soon!

There's a whole grey area of these spin-off bands with names altered by contractual agreement or legal battle.

Asia, without the "Featuring John Payne" appendage, always had at least one original member (depending on how you define "original member": Wetton and Howe were working together for some months before Downes and Palmer came in). However, Asia are example of another phenomenon, having two entirely non-overlapping line-ups, as you had a 1989 tour with Wetton and Palmer with John Young on keyboards versus most of the 1990s with Downes + Payne.

Henry

[bondegezou]

Split Enz?

Released one album with no original members (Tim Finn having gone, with brother Neil Finn, who wasn't originally in the band, now running the show). Although they still had Eddie Rayner and Noel Crombie from the band's first album.

The line-up's one album did make the top 30 in Australia and NZ, but they didn't last long and got Tim back for a tour, which then kinda morphed into Crowded House.

So, yes. Reasonable success with no original members, but this illustrates the now familiar pattern of a messy beginning and line-up changes before the first album (thus disqualifying Rayner and Crombie as original members) and a fairly short life without any original members.

Henry