OK...this should spark some interesting discussion here...
http://www.msn.com/en-us/music/news/...hE0n?ocid=iehp
OK...this should spark some interesting discussion here...
http://www.msn.com/en-us/music/news/...hE0n?ocid=iehp
Did Kanye write that article under a pseudonym?
If, indeed, the rap style of talking over a beat sans melody, harmony, singing, or music, had a greater influence on modern pop music than the actual music of the Beatles, then modern pop music must be very pathetic indeed. And perhaps it is.
We're trying to build a monument to show that we were here
It won't be visible through the air
And there won't be any shade to cool the monument to prove that we were here. - Gene Parsons, 1973
The final sentence of the article made me sit up and take notice:
That makes it hard to take the rest of the article seriously.The authors also rejected the assertion that today's pop music is increasingly homogenized.
Still, their assertion COULD be true according to their definition of "influence". I'm not sure it was ever claimed that the Beatles et al changed the nature of popular music, at least not in an abrupt way in the manner that rap has done. There is a continuity between the Everly Brothers, Buddy Holly, Bobby Vee, the Beatles, the Stones, the Hollies, the Who. It was evolution rather than revolution.
I'm surprised they didn't see fit to mention the rise of punk in the late 1970s, because I think that was a far bigger event than New Wave. In any case, surely new Wave happened before the synth thing? The Police and The Cars were seen as New Wave, and they were 1979 or so.
Last edited by bob_32_116; 05-06-2015 at 12:47 PM.
When rap first came around, I thought it was a fad that would pass as quickly as gas. How much more wrong could I have been?! The answer is none; none more wrong.
I can't help but feel that it's a genre that was shoved down the (young) public's throat by the Industry. Hell, it's much cheaper to make and if it sells as well or better than pop/rock, it was a no-brainer for them; after all, it's all about profit.
But what do I know? I'm an old guy who likes melodic and harmonic content and rhythmic variety. In other words, a dinosaur.
When rap first came around, I thought it was a fad that would pass as quickly as gas.
Same here.
Rap took off for the same reason that rock'n' roll took off, and punk took off. It was a way for one generation to stick it up the previous generation.
To a lot of young people, there is nothing more uncool than liking the same thing your parents like. That's why hair went long in the 1960s, then went short again when the long-haired kids became fathers. That's why tight jeans came in, then went out, and are now back in again.
In the case of rap, the fact that it was almost universally hated by anyone over 25 more or less guaranteed its success.
i like the post above by bob, bang on. older generations have no right to dictate where the future of pop and rnr music gos, thats always driven by kids. we should have also realised that technology might take us places were not comfy with. too bad. its music to the fans of the genre. kraftwerk is often cited as influencial on rap. is kraftwerk real music? anyway i liked rap from the first time i heard it, a cool radio station that played lots of prog started playing the big hit by grandmaster flash and the furious five. lol how could you not like it? lol its not my fave genre by far but i see the merit in what they do. and it's lasted much longer than prog, punk and new wave put together
The funny thing is, I actually didn't mind those early rap records when they came out, like The Message and Rapper's Delight; it was interesting, and a novelty. In my case it was a novelty that wore off very quickly.
Yes, I always rebelled against it in my own way, sticking to the 50s/60s/70s stuff. I've never related to rap at all. But it's no good burying one's head in the sand about rock's decline. It doesn't speak to youth in the way it did because it's simply not as good as it used to be IMHO.
As for the other point, I have become troubled about the simplistic writing of history that does play down what came before The Beatles. I'm more or less a life-long Elvis fan as well, though, so I would say that. But The Beatles themselves certainly never hid their influences, so I think a point is being missed about them having 'invented' this and that.
Last edited by JJ88; 05-06-2015 at 02:04 PM.
I agree with that. Very few youngsters today even know who The Beatles are. And youngsters creating music today aren't borrowing anything from The Beatles.Originally Posted by Supersonic Scientist
When I was a teen in the 70s, I wasn't listening to music from the 1920s - 1925 to 1975 is FIFTY years
Accordingly 1965 to 2015 is FIFTY years.
So why would youngters today bei nterested in a band from about 50 years ago!
^But the reverse side of that argument is that how many young rap fans know anything about 'Rapper's Delight' or 'The Message' either. Someone I used to be friendly with knew the history of the genre well, often asking me what old soul records were being sampled in particular rap tracks, but he was in a minority, in my experience.
I don't know, but some of them are... and even in music more than 50 years old. I'm guessing that more often than not, it's parental influence. Or sometimes kids raid their parents record collection on their own and find that they like yesterday's music more than todays. Certainly not the majority of them, but it does happen... and that's how older styles of music survive, regardless of it's status with the masses. Heck, every once in a while, I'll meet a twentysomething musician who can play the crap out of bebop... and that's music from 70 years ago!
My 13-year-old daughter is a huge Beatles fan - and I really didn't promote it much. She just was drawn to it.
She also loves Andy Williams. I'll never understand that one.
She's not into any rappers, that I know of.
Music isn't about chops, or even about talent - it's about sound and the way that sound communicates to people. Mike Keneally
^Andy Williams had a bit of a revival in the UK in the late 90s. A marvellous singer IMHO.
Blur was quite inspired by Beatles, or ?
My 3 kids age 25, 20 and 14 loves Beatles and detest rap.
There a a few tracks I enjoy like: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7t8eoA_1jQ
Well, rap is a genre, the Beatles are a band.
That said, the Beatles are kind of fading into the rear view window of history. Hip-hop is past its golden age, but still going fairly strong, I guess.
My 22 year old has loved the Beatles since she was 10. She likes hip hop, and weird alternative stuff like Mars Volta too. She's normal.
Rap didnt fade as a fad but took off as an entity as a direct result of Budget Cuts in Public Schools. In the early 80s, one of the first victims to Reaganomics was a drastic reduction of funding for the arts programs in public schools. If you take the saxophones, trumpets, and drums out of public schools, what is a poor urban kid supposed to make music on? Rap provided that solution
I usually wind up making that point in just about every thread that warrants it since Ive been here.......I usually do it in the form of a quote: "Turn That Crap Off" by My Parents c. 1983 ...... Its amazing, but not surprising, how many people were so open-minded as kids that have turned into their parents
I came into this thread to post this exact point
You are a lil out of touch here, PeterAlong with the subsequent posts made by others in this thread, I myself have noticed that the 15 - 25 year old Generation most certainly knows who The Beatles are, and a good many of them have The Beatles - as well as all sorts of music from the 60s to now - on their assorted iToyz, phones, and music players. Ironically - it seems that their least favorite era is the 90s, just like me.
My 7-year-old LOVES The Beatles....she got hooked on "Yellow Submarine" a few years ago and has gotten into them and their music ever since -- to the point where she has a poster on her wall (along with One Direction) and can name all four members.....She also likes Yes, but only selected songs (She loves "Your Move/ Seen All Good People")
H.L. Mencken said "No one in this world, so far as I know -- and I have searched the record for years, and employed agents to help me -- has ever lost money by underestimating the intelligence of the great masses of the plain people."
Yup, you hit the nail on the head. I remember the first time I heard rap I was a freshman in college and a guy who lived on the same floor in my dorm would play “Rappers Delight” pretty much constantly by the Sugar Hill Gang. This guy played on the basketball team and was exposed to rap from some of the guys on the team, and totally got into it. At the time he was the ONLY person I knew who liked rap (or even knew what it was). This was 1980 and we all thought it was just a fad and that this guy was nuts. Little did we know………
Anyway, as far as influence goes I think it is only natural that the further the Beatles fade into the past the less their influence will be recognized by new generations. In fact I think it is pretty amazing the stature they still have in 2015. Don’t get me wrong, I love the Beatles and personally find them to be the most influential band in history, but the article does not totally surprise me either.
I am ok with that.
Apologies to anyone here who's a fan, but in my ancient dinosaur world, rap music is an oxymoron.
I'm with Ernie.
Last edited by progeezer; 05-07-2015 at 01:52 AM.
"My choice early in life was either to be a piano player in a whorehouse or a politician, and to tell the truth, there's hardly any difference"
President Harry S. Truman
Is it April 1 again already?!
When rap fans grow up, get married and have kids, I can't wait to see what kind of music their kids play to piss them off.
Or maybe I can...
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